Artist – Pat Bagley

I highly recommend reading Tim Wise on white privilege and how it pertains to the Boston marathon bombing.

We’ve already seen signs of this.

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  • Lady Willpower

    I’m really in no mood to read another tedious piece on White Privilege, thanks.
    It’s too soon for anyone to be capitalizing on this tragedy, including yet another well-meaning white person who wants me to know they know about privilege.
    It’s just getting old.

    • JMAshby

      So you didn’t read it, but you’re going to pass judgment anyway.

      You could have kept that to yourself if you weren’t even going to look at it.

      • Lady Willpower

        Actually I did read it, and it was exactly what I expected. Because even though I didn’t want to read it, I knew you’d pull that line on me. My opinion is unchanged; it’s too soon for shit like this. Politicizing a tragedy can seem just as scummy when it’s someone from my “side” doing it.
        Also, isn’t this a website where you want input from your readers? Or am I misunderstanding your intentions? If you just want huzzahs and head-nods for every article you post, then you’ve come to the wrong place.

        • 1933john


        • JMAshby


          If you think discussing the terms of racial profiling and how we generalize groups of people is “politicizing” I think you’re the one who came to the wrong place.

          • Lady Willpower

            It’s not the issue. It’s the time frame. Barely a day after the tragedy. For me it feels too soon. Too soon to point out how it’s all going to go wrong (again).
            Sorry if you can’t take criticism, but that’s my opinion.

          • JMAshby

            Objecting to your points doesn’t mean I can’t take criticism. It means I don’t agree.

          • Jeremy Grunloh

            “Barely a day after the tragedy. For me it feels too soon.”

            You felt the same way about the subject of gun control after Sandy Hook too, right? Somehow I doubt it.

          • Lady Willpower

            Do I know you? I couldn’t even look at the internet for a week after Sandy Hook. I wanted to stay in my room and cry the whole time.
            You know nothing about me, asshole.

          • Jeremy Grunloh

            I didn’t ask if you went on the internet.

          • Lady Willpower

            Oh, do fuck right off.
            There. Not being weepy anymore.

          • Jeremy Grunloh

            I accept your concession.

          • Lady Willpower

            Oh, is that what you think it means when a woman tells you to fuck off?
            That’s disturbing.

          • Christopher Foxx

            It’s not the issue. It’s the time frame. Barely a day after the tragedy. For me it feels too soon.

            I never understood the “too soon” meme. Is the a reference manual for this sort of thing? Some sort of formula that can be applied? A week per victim?How much additional time if the victims were young? Who determines when it’s no longer “too soon”? Does everyone have to wait until it’s no longer “too soon” for you? What if you’re ready but it’s still “too soon” for me, do you then have to wait? What if someone else is never going to be okay with it?

            If it’s too soon for you, fair enough. But then stay away from places where it’s being discussed. If you just want deference and silence from every one who posts, “then you’ve come to the wrong place.”

          • Lady Willpower

            Does it help if I feel the same way about republicans who wasted no time in blaming Muslims? It’s not that I want a blanket cone of silence for some period of time to be determined by me and me alone.
            I just thought that this particular article was 1. hamfisted, 2. a rehash of things I’ve read many times before, and 3. not appropriate at the time.
            Just my opinion. Yes, I could have just chosen not to read it and not give my opinion. But saying nothing didn’t feel right.

  • Michael Norris

    Brilliant and courageous…

  • Chez Pazienza

    You get your white liberal guilt assuagement merit badge for that one, Ashby? Wise is an arrogant, pious jackass and his desperate need to shit-stir and to prove he’s more evolved than the rest of us beat down whatever good taste and sense of shame he should hold dear to 24-hours after a bombing that killed three people. Fuck his lecture.

    • JMAshby

      That’s pretty nasty.

      No, I don’t feel guilty. I felt it was a relevant take (particularly the numerous past examples cited) given that what we saw today was a series of associations of immigration with the marathon bombing. Because if whoever did it was X or Y, then clearly we need to ban X or Y people.

      I took it as a cautionary message, not a “lecture.”

      For example, an airline was diverted today because two passengers were speaking to each other in Arabic. No other reason.

      Why was there so much focus on a Saudi student during the previous 24 hours who turned out to be a witness rather than a suspect?

      Is it such a crime to stop and examine ourselves? You may be right that it’s “too soon,” but I already touched on this subject earlier today and it seemingly only became a trespass after I linked to someone else’s take on it who clearly draws your ire.

      I take the issue of self-examination seriously and it’s something I always take into account when I consider recent events Not just after a tragedy. I’m not looking for a “merit badge.” And I don’t even know why you would suggest that.

      • Chez Pazienza

        What Wise delivered was absolutely a lecture, right down to the “I know this is going to piss you off but whatever, you need to hear this” line. No one will argue that if you’re white in America you’ve got it pretty good; I have no issue with acknowledging this. But as I said to Bob earlier tonight, this idiotic thing where someone is expected to apologize for who he or she happens to be or to refrain from discussing certain topics because his or her “white privilege” will be showing is ridiculous — and it’s become an all-too-common theme in liberal politics.

        Also, yes, assholes like Wise and David Sirota take that position because they wear their martyrdom like a badge of honor to simultaneously prove how great they are to those they hope to ingratiate themselves to while trolling everyone else. Speaking of which, yeah, it’s too soon. Wait for the actual facts to come in before you make a sanctimonious political point that trolls that hard and begins demanding that we all point the finger at ourselves.

        • Jeremy Grunloh

          Oh my gawd, really? You’re comparing Wise to Sirota and Greenwald? Weak, Chez. Weak.

        • Christopher Foxx

          this idiotic thing where someone is expected to apologize for who he or she happens to be or to refrain from discussing certain topics because his or her “white privilege” will be showing is ridiculous

          I must have missed where Wise called for an apology or a refrainment from discussion. I’ll have to look again.

          Hmmm. Nope. Still not seeing it.

    • Jeremy Grunloh

      Your man-crush on Chris Christie suddenly makes a lot more sense.

      • Chez Pazienza

        You’re precious, Jeremy. There was a direct connection between gun control and stopping Sandy Hook — or stopping another Sandy Hook. Also, it was a gun that caused Sandy Hook, ergo, again, direct connection. Sirota and Wise are writing pieces that essentially rely on speculating as to the race and ethnicity of the Boston bomber; they’re essentially creating hypotheticals to make a political point, one that may or may not have merit but is still a political point. Now I know this won’t satisfy you and you’ll come back with something pissy and only pseudo-intellectual, but I’m going to pretend for just a moment that you have a real point you’d like to make other than to lash out in my direction because it inexplicably makes you feel important or some shit.

        • Jeremy Grunloh

          “You’re precious, Jeremy”
          And you’re a condescending prick.

    • Christopher Foxx

      Why actually respond to anything Wise said when you can just go ad hominem, right?

  • IrishGrrrl

    I just read the Wise piece and it seems to me that he’s articulating something many have already brought up here in previous threads….that if the bomber is white, domestic terrorist, nothing will come of it in regards to our national memory and there won’t be any long term repercussions against such people. Americans won’t remember him or even share him as a cautionary tale to their children in the future. But the now defunct Black Panthers from decades ago…..ooga booga!

    Wise’ tone seemed rather heartfelt. I mean anytime you tell someone a hard truth it’s going to piss them off. Was it condescending? To some, yes, I can see how it would be taken that way. However, I would think that it could only be condescending to those who don’t already acknowledge what he is pointing out.

    Nor do I think it is politicizing it too soon. Was it too soon for us to say what we did the day of and day after it happened–that it probably was some rightwing nutjob and that no one in the MSM or the right will acknowledge what is a growing trend in this country? So far as I know we were stating (and he is stating) something many on the left already know to be true but that tens of millions of white people in America do not yet understand. And since the American public has an attention span roughly equivalent to the life span of a mayfly, when is the right time? After no one is even paying attention the bombing?

    I don’t mean to disparage anyone who felt it was a lecture or too soon or too political at this juncture. I respect your opinion but I disagree. My very, very little two cents for what it’s worth.

  • nicole

    Two days late is what I am, but I am in the mood to put in my 2 cents.

    So, Ashby, I understand your motivation, and I like Tim Wise’s writings in general, but we need some time to feel shocked and grieve.

    That said, every time my son hits the door, I am desperately thankful that his skin is white. I feel enough pain for black mothers everywhere in this country, that it makes me cry. The injustice is astounding and needs to be addressed. It would probably have more impact if it was addressed at a time when we’re not facing a national crisis.

    I may very well be wrong, as I often am, but that’s how I feel.